From Copywriter To One Of The Best SEO Course Providers For Small Business Owners – This Is Kate Toon’s Origin Story

It’s no secret that the industry is dominated by men. Unlike social media marketing, HR and marketing in general there tends to be fewer females in search engine optimisations. But that’s not to say that there are no women in SEO because there are! And they are incredible at what they do!

Did you know it was a woman who spent $17,000 of her own money on legal fees to ensure that SEO would not be trademarked?

I have wanted to champion women and I was incredibly excited and honoured to sit down with Kate Toon for this episode of Make SEO Simple Again. So much so that I put down my fear of hosting a podcast interview over the Internet.

In this episode, I explore Kate’s origin story of how she fell into SEO, why she loves teaching SEO, and why she says no to big and exciting copywriting jobs from major international brands. She reveals how she overcame her imposter syndrome and shares how her reaction and response to trolls and haters have evolved as she grew her own brand and confidence.

From speaking with Kate, I got the sense that she really cares about her students because getting traffic and conversions for the average small business owner makes all the difference whether they can send their children to extra curricular activities, pay the bills, and plan for a holiday.

So without further ado, let’s dive in!

Prefer to tune in via your favourite podcast app? I’ve got you covered.

Full Transcript

DANIEL: Welcome to the show, Kate. For those of us who don’t know you, why don’t you give us a brief intro?

KATE: Well, hello. It’s lovely to be here. Thanks for having me. So my name’s Kate Toon and from the SEO side of my business, I run something called the Recipe for SEO Success, which is an online learning hub for all things search engine optimization and digital marketing, and there’s courses and resources and a membership group, and a podcast. So, yeah.

DANIEL: Exciting stuff. And how did you kind of fall into this? I’m sure you didn’t graduate from high school and go, “I’m going to become a podcast/copywriter” or whatever it is that you do.
KATE: Well, I graduated from high school a very long time ago. I’m very old, and podcasting didn’t exist when I left high school, so no, I definitely didn’t think that. I left university, did a ridiculously pointless degree in Roman history…

DANIEL: Wow.

KATE: … and worked in advertising for a long time, so both in the UK and in Australia. I got into digital probably – I’m thinking 1995 and I built the Marks & Spencer’s is e-commerce website, the first e-commerce website in the UK, which was a big challenge. You know, no one had built an online store in the UK so we had to like out work out all these things. So that was fun, and then [inaudible 0:03:16.5] Australia, worked at Ogilvy for a while and lots of big brands like American Express and Telstra, and Qantas. Then back to UK, worked on ‘02 at Microsoft, and then came back here and did contracting for a while, again, in agency life.

And I’d always been dabbling in SEO. See, I was just beginning then and a bit of affiliate marketing, Google AdWords, and doing lots of work for big brands like Pedigree, Charm and Kmart on doing audits and technical audits on their sites. And then in about 2009 – I know that because that’s when my son was born – I gave up working in agency world and I started my own business and very quickly realized that there were quite a few other copywriters in Australia and that if I wanted to be found, I might have to use some of that big brand SEO experience for my own website. And did, got to number for hundreds of keywords for copywriting. I was able to build a really successful copywriting business, and then I kind of wanted to do the whole passive income thing, and that’s where the whole turning my SEO knowledge into courses and workshops, and resources, kind of was born.

So that was about five years ago that I kind of moved from being a service-based business into being more of a passive income style business.

No that there’s anything passive about.

DANIEL: It never is.

KATE: No.

DANIEL: That’s an incredible progression of where you started, Marks & Spencer, to where you are now. What excites you the most about what you do?

KATE: I think these days it’s seeing my students get results. I think a lot of the sort of SEO tactics that I talked about online are kind of big brand ideas, you know, like these backlink strategies and outreach strategies are just not attainable by the smaller businesses and soloists just don’t have the time or the resources to do them. So I like seeing, you know, small business owners make big wins online, and get the traffic and conversions that they want. But I also love seeing the expression on people’s faces when they finally get it, when they get the concept, you know, like learning about stuff like skimmer, an AMP, and international SEO. It’s tough, you know, to understand it if you’re not technically minded or you’re not just digitally-minded.

And many small business owners, you know, they’re accountants. You know, they want to sell kids shoes. They didn’t come into this wanting to learn how to work out how to do structured data. So for me to be able to break it down into bite-size chunks and for them to get it, I see that “Ah ha” moment on their face and it’s a lovely thing to see.

DANIEL: Indeed. And that’s exactly what I witnessed at that recent conference in Melbourne and DMA when – that’s probably the first time I saw and heard you speak, is that you broke something very sophisticated, often by purpose, into something that anyone could kind of grasp and go, “I can try and do it” and not… SEO can be very technical and it is in some areas, but you made it like accessible that anyone could try. And even if they completely get it wrong, they had a go at it.

KATE: Yeah.

DANIEL: And that’s what I got away from watching you on the stage in that turquoise, awesome dress.

KATE: Thank you.

DANIEL: Yeah, like you make it easy. Like not easy, but you make it approachable, and that’s what I think a lot of SEOs in the industry have kind of not done purposely.

KATE: I think it is purposely. I love that you said that. I think there’s obviously a lot of money to be made by making SEO seem more complex than it is by making it seem like a dark art, that you need to have a certain level of intelligence and understanding and also by kind of implying that there’s a secret, that this is this kind of magic juju which…

DANIEL: Hang on, there’s no secret?! What!

KATE: Yeah, exactly. So yeah, I also think it’s really important to point out to people that SEO can be really enjoyable. Like a lot of SEO is pretty black and white. You know, you start with a site speed of 12 seconds, you get it down to 3 seconds. That’s pretty black and white. There’s no abstract confusion there, and that’s a huge sense of achievement. Again, these small wins that people can make, you know, when they do start seeing themselves begin to rank and they do start seeing their trafficking free. That’s hugely meaningful to these small business owners because this is the difference between them going on holiday or not, or paying for their kid’s karate lesson or not.

You know, it’s not some big brand selling more of blue widget or red widget. It’s going to make a difference to their actual lives. So I try to make it fun. I use a lot of analogies and I do a lot of study. I mean, to explain something easily, you have to understand it very, very well.

And some people in our industry have kind of sometimes accused me of dumbing it down, but you have to kind of dumb it down to a certain level to let people get in, and then you slowly build them up. And my courses would never have someone finishing being able to do SEO at the level of a top-grade SEO consultant in an agency. But most of the people I’m working with, they don’t need that but it will get them to the point where they can pretty much do what your average SEO can do every month, you know.

It may take them a bit longer but yeah, I think it’s important to make it accessible. A lot of the people who do my courses, for example, get to the end of it and go, “Okay, I understand it and I don’t want to do it.”

DANIEL: But they know what’s implied and then they can hire the right person.

KATE: Then they hire the right person and they become really great clients because they appreciate what goes into it. You know, when people come to me and say, “Oh, this SEO consultant said it’s gonna be $2,000 a month. It’s outrageous!”

And I’m like, “Well, that’s probably about 10 to 15 hours of a person. What could you do in 10 hours? How many blogs could you write? How many backlinks could you build? How many pages could you optimize, phone calls could you make, reports could you run? When you start to break it down, that’s actually pretty reasonable, you know. And also, you’re in a competitive niche and that’s going to take, you know…”

So then they’re like, “Oh, actually, two grand is a good investment and I’m gonna get maybe make back 30 grand from that two grand. So the ROI is great.”

So yeah, it’s not about educating people out of the market of wanting SEO consultant. Some people would never pay for an SEO consultant but I do think it helps people appreciate what we do a little bit more.

DANIEL: Indeed. And thank you for doing that for all of us.

KATE: [inaudible 0:09:43.6]

DANIEL: Okay. Actually, tell me more about your course. I’m intrigued. Like who is it for, what does it look like, and what’s the progression stages? Like is it for small business owners or people in marketing?

KATE: It’s for… I mean, you’re not supposed to say our target market is everyone, but I’ve had all sorts of people. So I’ve had big brand, marketing managers from big brands and banks, and charities, come aboard and do it. I’ve had a lot of SEO consultants do it, possibly for the affirmation, because there’s a big thing with SEO that you don’t want to be seen to be asking too many questions because you’re showing that you don’t know what you’re talking about. But we all have questions and we all want to know how other people do it and make sure that we’re doing it right. Like “I’m doing my keyword research like this, but is this how everyone else does it?”

DANIEL: Right, got you.

KATE: Most of it, mostly I’d say it’s small business, e-commerce store owners, marketers, copywriters, developers, graphic designers. So it’s a big mix. You know, funeral directors, hairdressers, you name it. And there’s a kind of a funnel. We all love a funnel. Slippery little funnel. So it starts off with a course called the SEO Nibbles which is really the absolute basic, so nibbling at SEO. And then I have something called the 10-Day Challenge, which is like the first ten things. You know, looks at things like optimizing images, improving your speed like your title tags. the basics, you know, setting up Google Search console. And then the big course is a monster.

DANIEL: Wow.

KATE: It’s eight week technical SEO, two weeks on tech SEO, authorizing backlinks, keyword research, content marketing, measurement analytics, e-commerce SEO and local SEO.

DANIEL: Wow. Sounds very… So the best way would be to start from Nibbles and then progress your way through upskill and then – incredible. And I’m going to link to each one of these in the show notes.

KATE: Thank you very much. And it is huge.

DANIEL: You’re most welcome.

KATE: I mean, the big course has over a hundred videos. It’s not so much a course, like I said, a learning hub. I give everybody lifetime access to the course.

DANIEL: Awesome.

KATE: And I’ll have to update it every year, which takes me at least two months to remake the videos because everything changed, you know. So people get to access it forever, and that is important because it’s a lot to get through. I mean, I’ll tell you something embarrassing. Sometimes I even go back and watch my own videos on how to do stuff because I’ve forgotten. You know, because you can’t keep everything in your brain all the time. So yeah, I use my own course as my own resource.

DANIEL: Fantastic. So is it more treated like a textbook and you hit chapters that are applicable to you or do you start from page one, video one, all the way to video one million?

KATE: Pretty much because while I don’t use the secret to SEO, I do think it’s a process. So you know, I make them do all the tech stuff in weeks two and three, because there’s no point optimizing a blog post when your site needs 22 seconds. So you know, there is a progression. They do have to go through it bit by bit but, obviously, some people skip and get to the bits that they enjoy but they have the option of going back. But you know, my order is tech, then understand the audience and keywords, then optimizing your own page, then working on your off-page and then measuring and repeating, repeat, repeat [inaudible 0:13:01.8].

DANIEL: I like it. I like it a lot. Awesome. I’m actually going to check it out. I think I will.

KATE: You do that. You’ll probably know it all, but some…

DANIEL: Oh, no. I don’t. I really don’t. We’re all learning, and I’ve never been really the technical person.

KATE: Yeah. Well, I think often people don’t think I am because they think lots of SEOs come from different backgrounds. So you know, a lot of techs. SEOs come from a tech background, maybe they were web developers or whatever. And obviously, I come from a creative background. But just because you’re creative doesn’t mean you can’t learn tech and just cause your tech you can’t learn creatives.

DANIEL: That’s right.

KATE: So you know, I think… And again, it’s what level you want to get to. As long as you got your grasp on AMP and skimmer, and its scrollability and site speed, you know, those mobile responsiveness. You know, they’re really hard core tweaks so you need to learn Python and all that kind of stuff. Most mom and pop businesses and most mid-level businesses, I’m just not sure they need that level of SEO to compete and to make the income targets that they have, you know. So it’s a different kettle of fish, I think.

DANIEL: Sure. Like personally, I don’t think I’ll ever learn Python because I think there’s better ways of using my time or I’ll just not spend it at work, I’ll just do other things that I enjoy. But you know, some people would want to automate with Python, that’s just not me.

KATE: Exactly. And I think, you know, a big part of running a business, doing anything, is understanding where your skills lie, understanding what’s involved, and then making a decision about what you outsource.

I mean, in my business, for example, I have no interest in accounts and bookkeeping. I have a firm enough grasp that I can know what I need and know what is not being done properly, but I have no interest in it. I could learn it, you know, brilliant, but I don’t want to, and that’s a really important part of, you know, having a job, having a business, is knowing where your skills lie and knowing where your enjoyment lies. There’s no point doing something they loathe, you know, especially if it’s your own business. What’s the point? You may as well get a job, you know.

DANIEL: Like in the short time that we’ve just conversed, I get the sense that you really understand what a small business owner wants and it isn’t to become a master of SEO digital marketing, it’s just what do they need to learn so they can upskill and be at a competitive level to their industry. And I think that’s not the messaging that a lot of, I guess, marketing people have, especially in the SEO space, and that’s refreshing to hear from you, is that you have that empathy and you understand what your client wants and you are able to help them achieve it.

KATE: Yeah. I mean, I’ve had, I think, over 9,000 people do the range of courses but I’ve had nearly 900 do the big course and it’s the same – it’s almost like clockwork now. Like I know the bits they’re gonna find challenging, I know the bits where they’re going to get upset and want to give up, and whatever. And when you run courses, it’s a large part of your success metric is completion. You know, you want people – I want people to finish it because then they’re going to become advocates for the course. I don’t do any paid ads. I’ve never done any paid ads for my courses. So all of it is word-of-mouth and content marketing. So I need people to finish the course, feeling super positive about it because they then go out into the world. And if every one of them tells one person…

DANIEL: Exactly.

KATE: That’s another potential customer. So it’s really important for me to have that empathy and to… I’ve redone the course 12 times since I launched it. Restructured it, changed it, added bits, taken bits away. A lot of it was taking content out because there’s this desire to tell people everything, but people don’t want to know everything. Like you said, they want to know – people actually want to know the bare minimum for success, you know.

DANIEL: So true.

KATE: So taking stuff out has actually made it more easy to complete, seem less overwhelming. But yeah, I really enjoy it and I obviously therefore don’t get to do a lot of SEO as a service anymore, I don’t do audits, I don’t do… I have no copywriting clients now [inaudible 0:17:02.8].

DANIEL: Do you miss it?

KATE: I miss the creativity. I do get offered amazing opportunities now because I’m, you know, I get to often work with really great brands I would love to work with. But I don’t like being told what to do. So the truth is when you were in service, you’re in a service based business, the client’s your boss, you know. And well, now my customers are my boss. It’s a bit of a different relationship because, you know, I struggle doing work for other people. I really like – I find a lot of creative people in marketing my own business on my own and finding new fun ways of marketing stuff. I’ve just been making little videos this morning for YouTube.

DANIEL: Wow. Yeah.

KATE: [inaudible 0:17:46.1] micro tutorials for different free tools, and I love that I get to decide to do that today and then if I don’t want to do it tomorrow… I have to do it tomorrow. I love that. I love being my own boss.

DANIEL: Awesome.

KATE: I don’t think anyone would employ me anymore.

DANIEL: That’s not true. I felt the same way. I felt the same way, like I tasted that freedom. Sometimes I miss it. I was a wedding photographer for like 10 years and, you know.

KATE: Yeah.

DANIEL: They always joke that I have a five-day weekend, but that’s not true, and I thought, I’m unemployable but then, you know, James came along and he offered me a job so…

KATE: He’s just a very nice man. I think you probably are unemployable but he just [inaudible 0:18:22.5]

DANIEL: So, yeah, okay. He is a very nice man. Let’s talk about – I guess I want to jump straight into perhaps your biggest challenge that you faced so far. And it doesn’t have to be business, it could be interwoven with personal and how that’s affected everything.

KATE: I think there’s been a few. There’s been a few although most of them… I don’t think I’d do something and it doesn’t particularly work out. I’m very much of the mindset of “Well, that was just an experiment and I’ll try again.” So I’ve never lost a big amount of money. I had a huge failure, you know. I’ve sold out the course every time since the second round I run it so financially, everything’s good. From a logistics point of view and team, I’ve tried different models, and that has worked out. I think the biggest challenges for me have all been mindset. So the first ones I think we’re impostor syndrome, you know, coming into a space like SEO, super competitive, very masculine energy. People are very kind of brouhaha, [inaudible 0:19:24.2] “I know this, you don’t,” and you know, that was challenging when I first started out because, you know, I started doing all this about 11 years ago.

There are a lot more female SEOs now, but there really weren’t that many back then, Ann Hadley and a few others. There weren’t that many, you know, and you go into big groups on GooglePlus and you’d be the only woman in the group asking questions, and that was challenging. So impostor syndrome and inferiority complex. And then as you get better known, that doesn’t go away because then I start, you know… Like last year I was just talking to you, I went and presented Yoast Con, which is big for me. You know, to stand up in front of Yoast and Marieke, and Rand Fishkin and Jono Alderson, and talk about SEO copywriting from the people that I learned SEO copywriting from was quite challenging. And to sit on stage next to Rand Fishkin and be on a panel, it was like, “Why am I here?” You know, like “This is ridiculous. Why would anyone take me seriously?”

And that’s been the biggest thing, I think, comparisonitis, impostor syndrome, and you know, I think it keeps you humble. Like you said earlier, I still feel like I’m still learning. I would never call myself an expert. Those people know a lot more than me. But I think I’ve found my place in the kind of the SEO ecosystem, as well. I’m not a pioneer. I’m not like Bill Slawski or something, looking at patents or coming up with like these experiments that they rewrite 7,000 title tags and… I’m not that kind of person. I don’t have the time, to be frank. I still only work 20 hours a week. I feel that a little bit I’m a translator, you know. I can take that complex blog written by the Uber expert that none of us really quite understands and I can read it and turn it into something that normal people get, and not just get, that they retain and then implement. And I’ve learned that that’s a great skill, as well.

DANIEL: It is.

KATE: We don’t all have to be researchers and pioneers. Some of us can be the workers, some of this could be the teachers, and we all have our place in the ecosystem.

DANIEL: Beautifully spoken.

KATE: A bit of a babble, I’m sorry.

DANIEL: No, that was good. I want to go back to like the mindset issue. How did you overcome that impostor syndrome and also that overwhelming feeling of you’re the only female in the room because you were back then?

KATE: Well, I mean, even when we had our conference [inaudible 0:21:44.10] hard to get the diversity going, but obviously it’s still very male dominated. The female things never really bothered me because, you know, I’m – I guess in the old days you called me a tomboy. Most of my friends are boys, I’ve always worked in the male industry, so that didn’t bother me so much. The impostor syndrome, I mean, I think if you don’t worry about that, if you don’t worry about not knowing enough, then you have a problem. You know, I think it’s good to be humble and strive to be better. In terms of getting over like the impostor syndrome of speaking and being with my peers, and talking about things with confidence when you know that other people are gonna come at you, I think you just just develop a thick skin over time.

My next book that I’m writing is called “Be More Shark” and it’s about just being fearless in business. And it’s a lot of understanding that the fear never goes away. You don’t lose the fear, you know, even talking to people like Rand and Jono before they go onstage, I’m like, “Do you have the fear? Are you nervous?” and they’re like, “Yeah, of course, we are. Of course, we are.” Every time, like everyone is. It doesn’t go away, but you learn how to channel it. You learn how to use it. You learn how to ignore it for just long enough to get started. And as soon as you get started, generally, it’s never as bad as you think it is, you know.

What’s the worst that can happen? I always thought with speaking, imagine if I just fall over on stage because I’m getting on stage, and that we are podcast a couple of years ago, I fell over as I got onto the stage? And it’s like, yeah, and I didn’t even manage to get my hands out so I literally hit the ground with my face.

DANIEL: Oh, no! Wow.

KATIE: I then got up and presented, and it went really well and it got good feedback. So the worst that can happen, you know, you’re worried that you’re gonna get heckled. You’re worried someone’s going to ask you something you don’t know. You’re worried you’re going to lose your train of thought. I think 99% of the audience is looking at you, wanting you to do well, and I don’t think that the audience, when you’re speaking… I mean, the audience in the world of whatever you’re doing, you’re running this podcast, people want it to be a success. They want it to be good. They want you to do well, 99% of those people. The 1% who’s a little troll, who is a little hater, you can’t let them stop you fulfilling your dreams and doing what you want to do, you know. That’s ridiculous. Why would one person’s opinion matter? So it’s a process, and it’s a work in progress, as well.

DANIEL: For sure. Very wise words. Which leads me into that next question. Perfect segue. How do you deal with the haters?

KATE: These days, I find them amusing. So these days when I get a negative comment or – God, I’ve had some funny ones. I had someone e-mail me, tell me I was too ugly to send them emails. That was a funny one.

DANIEL: Oh, my goodness.

KATE: It’s funny though. So I screen-grabbed it and shared it on social media, especially if it’s a troll, I will just name and shame. I will screengrab and [inaudible 0:24:31.5]. In the early days, it did used to cut me to the core because I wasn’t confident in myself. So anybody, if you’re not confident, anybody can knock you down, you know. Whereas now, I’m more confident, I know that some people are going to like me and some people aren’t. That’s okay. I don’t like everybody either, and everyone’s entitled to their opinion. And generally, I try and see where they’re coming from, as well. Like the person who said “You’re too ugly to send me emails,” they’re just having a bad day, man, you know, and what a weird thing to write someone. What a weird person he must be.

DANIEL: Of all the things you could say, you said that.

KATE: It’s such a weird thing! But other people, you know, would be like, “Ah, you don’t know what you’re talking about. Blah, blah, blah.” And you’re like, “Well, maybe I don’t. But the fact that you need to be the person to say that and say it publicly, you know, that that does say a lot more about you than it does about me. So I guess you just become philosophical. So these days, the trolls, I’m not encouraging everyone to start trolling me, but generally, it doesn’t bother me that much. I’m just kind of like whatever, focus on the good. Focus on the people that do love you.

DANIEL: Awesome. That’s something I’m still learning. Trolls are scary sometimes, because I let them be scary.

KATE: Yes. Yeah, but you know they’re – generally, especially, because I’ve met some of my trolls in real life and people who are really quite brutal to me in those early days when I was launching the course in those groups. And you know, when you meet them face-to-face, they find it very, very difficult to continue that line of trolling when they see you face-to-face. Then you realize they’re just cowards. You know, like I’ve never trolled anybody ever. Even if I spot a typo in someone’s work, I would always privately message them and say hey, or just not mention it all, just let them be, you know. Like there are ways and means of educating people and helping people. But [inaudible 0:26:21.2] everyone’s just – most people, again, 99% of people are just trying their best.

DANIEL: Yes.

KATE: So you know, why we on their bonfire?

DANIEL: Yeah.

KATE: Why be the person to snuff out their excitement? Just let people be. Let’s them get on with. It’s none of your business. Your opinion has nothing to do with me. You know, that’s what I think. Well, not you personally but…

DANIEL: Aww.

KATE: The masses. I value your opinion, Daniel. Of course, of course.

DANIEL: Oh, thank you. Thank you. Cool. Well, I think I’m ready to wrap things up here because I know you need to go and I’ve had a lovely conversation with you. Anything you wanto leave on? Like what’s new for you coming up, exciting stuff for Kate Toon?

KATE: Well, I’m relaunching my big course again this year and then in the second half of the year I’m doing a tour of the UK, which I’m quite excited about.

DANIEL: Okay.

KATE: Toon on Tour. So I’m speaking in London, Leeds, Manchester, and Edinburgh, which is exciting. And then the second half of the year for me, hopefully, is all about getting my new book out published, promoting that.

DANIEL: Nice. And that’s about the shark one?

KATE: Yeah, the “Be More Shark”. I’m still a writer at heart and, you know, that’s ultimately what I hope to be end up doing when I’m old and gray. But I think to finish, I’d just like to say that I think this is a really important podcast. I think there’s lots of important podcasts.

DANIEL: Well, thank you.

KATE: I have one myself, which is all about education and that’s important, too. But it’s really nice to have a podcast that shows the other side, the flipside that asks people about their feelings, their mindset, and their journey because there’s not enough of that in our industry, I don’t think.

DANIEL: No.

KATE: It can be a bit brouhaha.

DANIEL: That’s right.

KATE: I congratulate you for this idea.

DANIEL: Thank you.

KATE: I think it’s a great idea.

DANIEL: I want people to know the person behind the name because deep down we’re all people. We all have inadequacies and fears.

KATE: Hopefully, yeah.

DANIEL: And I just want to make people real because, as you said, when you meet a hater, when they actually meet you in person, they either coward away or they realize you’re actually normal. And that’s all I want to do.

KATE: Or that they’re mean, exactly. So, yeah, you’re showing the – I think it’s like the opposite of The Terminator. Everyone’s the Terminator on the outside, but they’re squishy and human on the inside, just something like that. I had to get a Terminator reference in.

DANIEL: Like all of them, even number four?

KATE: Even number four, [inaudible 0:28:37.0]. I don’t care if they’re bad, they’re still good. It’s not like the Matrix where 2 and 3, which is the worst films ever made. Like you know, come on, I don’t like the Matrix 3. No one…

DANIEL: Okay, the third was a bit too biblical for me. And yeah…

KATE: Number 2 was okay. I’ll give you Number 2.

DANIEL: Yeah.

KATE: But you know… The Terminator’s were all good. They’ve all got Arnold Schwarzenegger.

DANIEL: True.

KATE: So I can’t even say his name, Schwarzenegger. [inaudible 0:29:05.5]

DANIEL: Thank you for your time. I appreciate it. Oh, I do have a last question. If people want to contact you, what’s the best way? Are they allowed to?

KATE: They are not allowed to. No, they can just google Kate Toon. There aren’t many of us, so hopefully I will pop up somewhere there. One of my seven or eight websites, I can’t remember how many I’ve got. But you’ll find something to do with me and hopefully it slips down my funnel, which sounds filthy but you know what I mean.

DANIEL: Indeed. Well, thank you once again for your time, Kate, and all the best.

Find Out More About Kate Toon

Visit her (main) website: https://www.katetooncopywriter.com.au/

Kate produces a number of podcasts herself. Check them out here – https://www.katetoon.com/podcasts/. I highly recommend subscribing to The Recipe For SEO Success Show.

Join her (free) SEO Nibbles course.

Sign up to Kate’s 10 Day SEO Challenge (also free).

And when you’re ready to really learn the good stuff (explained in simple to understand language and instructions), you must check out The Recipe For SEO Success – an 8 week course that will help you win more customers and conversions from Google.

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